The Greatest Rivalry (2010) Chapter 4: An Interview

Teach and Iceman prepare for Round 2 of the 2009-10 Carolina-Duke rivalry, with Teach doing the recognizance work this time:

Teach: Duke is 25-4, but no one really mentions them when it comes to making the Final Four or winning a national title?  Why is that?  How does it make you feel, and could you relay your emotion in the form of a color?

 Iceman: Duke should be considered to be in the mix, but at the same time, they don't have the horses that many of the other "top" teams do.  I mean they began this season worried that they may only have 2 scholarship guards on the roster.  It's hard to conceive of a National Championship caliber team only having two guards, though in the end they did reap the early metriculation of Andre Dawkins.  If I had to pick a color to represent this team and my emotional state it would be Pink.  This is team is overwhelmingly young and full of untapped talent.  Other than the three seniors, I feel like everyone else has a chance to blossom next year, Singler and Smith included.

 Teach: How will the Jon Scheyer and Kyle Singler era be remembered?  Seeing as they remind me of late '70s/early '80s British punk rockers, are they more The Clash, The Sex Pistols, or The Jam?  I'll leave that open to interpretation.

Iceman: The Jam, easily.  Although the only difference here is that the Jam's last album was a massive success, they came in with a whimper and out with a bang, like many of their early-punk contemporaries.  But in the case of Scheyer/Singer, I'm thinking they be in with a bang (highly rated recruits) and out with a whimper.  I think these guys may be remembered like many of the other great Duke players who did not play on Championship caliber teams.  Great players who were unfortunately in some ways to be playing on teams in transition.  Scheyer in particular had the poor luck of playing on the youngest team in Duke history and has had to be a leader since he first stepped onto campus.  I'll remember them fondly, but not with the same adoration as a Jay Williams.

Teach: Where is Kyle Singler next year, and what do you make of the fact that in terms of attention and pub he's now seen as the second banana to Scheyer, much in the same way that Reddick cast a shadow over Sheldon Williams?  For the record, I always thought Sheldon was more important to those Duke teams.

Iceman: As of right now, I'd say Kyle is back on campus in the fall.  And on top of that, I think Kyle will have learned a little bit more about what it takes to play on the perimeter instead of the high post.  I think coming into this season, people were extraordinarily expecting Singler to be much more comfortable on the wing as opposed to his role as a PF his first two years in college and during HS.  Singler currently has the game of a guy who could a deep-threat Power Forward, and not a SF.  I think with more work on his ball handling and his jumpshot, Singler could truly transform his game heading into next season.  Now as for Scheyer overshadowing Singler....this was bound to happen in my mind when Singler began struggling shooting the ball and with his turnovers.  If anything it lowers draft expectations enough to get Kyle back for his senior season and forcing him to really improve his perimeter game during the offseason.

For the Record, I always thought Chris Duhon was the belt that made those two cogs turn.

Teach: The following is Duke's record and where they finished in the NCAA's for each year of this decade:

2000   Sweet Sixteen 29-5
2001   National Champions 35-4
2002   Sweet Sixteen 29-4
2003   Sweet Sixteen 26-7
2004   Final Four Runner-up 31-6
2005   Sweet Sixteen 27-6
2006   Sweet Sixteen 32-4
2007   First Round 22-11
2008   Second Round 28-6
2009   Sweet Sixteen 31-7

Which begs the question, how washed up is Coach K?

Iceman: This question always cracks me up.  Let me put it this way.  If I picked any school in the country besides UNC, Duke, UCLA, and maybe Kansas, and told them that during the next 10 years of college basketball seasons, they were going to have the exact results that you listed above.  I don't think there is a single school that tells me that's not a great future.  You basically have 10 years of at least 20 wins per season, you make it to the NCAA tourney every year, and only once do you lose in the first round.  On top of that you have two final fours and a championship.

Look, Coach K is not infallible, but the guy is far from washed up.

Also, under this logic, you could make the case that Dean Smith was washed up in the mid-1970's, before winning his first Championship in '82.  Short of the 1977 season in which they lost the Championship game, Dean's teams were doing exactly what Coach K's having been doing since 2001.

1972-1973	North Carolina	25-8	8-4	2nd	NIT 3rd Place
1973-1974	North Carolina	22-6	9-3	T-2nd	NIT 1st Round
1974-1975	North Carolina	23-8	8-4	T-2nd	NCAA 2nd Round
1975-1976	North Carolina	25-4	11-1	1st	NCAA 1st Round
1976-1977	North Carolina	28-5	9-3	1st	NCAA Runner Up
1977-1978	North Carolina	23-8	9-3	1st	NCAA 1st Round
1978-1979	North Carolina	23-9	9-3	1st	NCAA 2nd Round
1979-1980	North Carolina	21-8	9-5	T-2nd	NCAA 2nd Round

Teach: Is the myth of Coach K's demise due more to the early departures of Elton Brand/ Corey Maggette/ Luol Deng, K's foray into coaching the National team, or people just hating Duke?

Iceman: Numbers 1 and 2, Teach.  But not 3.  I don't believe people hating a team have a huge effect on their success.  Also, to call a team that consistently gets 20 wins a season and performs reasonably well in the NCAAs as having a "demise" is a little strong.  But I would say that despite all of the positive-spin PR, Duke has "struggled" for the following reasons: 1. The recruiting landscape has changed and Coach K did not immediately change with it, and 2. Despite glowing reviews, Coach K's Olympic foray did have an effect on his recruiting and level of involvement with Duke Basketball.  

I don't care what everyone says, there are only so many hours in the day and the Olympics definitely took a lot of K's energy.  I'm not bitter or angry about that fact, I deeply respect the man's commitment to our country, but I think it needs to be said.  As for recruiting, I think the NBA rule change, along with changing attitudes about the effectiveness of college basketball as a training ground and the necessity of making an effort academically, has challenged Coach K's recruiting strategy.  Once again, most media speculation is that Coach K was never affected by the changes in recruiting tides, but I think he has just started to grasp what you need do and who you need to get to compete at the top level in this day and age.  I think there is evidence that he has softened on his "anti-one-and-done" approach with the heavy (albeit futile) recruitment of both John Wall and Harrison Barnes.

 Teach: Does any of the Duke hate stem from the fact that so many of their superstars are white?  In other words, does the fact that they are often led by players who most perceive to be from out of a Bob Cousy time warp result in the white fan simply bashing white basketball players because deep down we're all jealous and looking to make ourselves feel better about our own lack of athleticism?

Iceman: Haha, with the likes of a JJ Redick, I think the jealousy aspect comes into play.  But as for Duke hate in general, I think it stems from a few places.

   1. Duke is a private, very exclusive, somewhat snobby University, and not a state school.
   2. Duke has been good for a very long time with very few lulls.
   3. Some of the players appear cocky and in some cases undeserving of the attention garnered.
   4. Dick Vitale.  I hate him even though he loves most of my guys.

On the whole, I think elements of Duke hate do stem from acts of jealousy and a sense of everyman, classist spite and angst.  Duke as an institution reeks of self-aggrandizing and elitist sentiments, and I think the general public and especially those with teams that have been beaten regularly by Duke, find this to be completely hate-able.  Frankly, I don't blame them.  Deep down, part of me hates Duke the University, but just not the basketball team.  

Teach: What does Wojo really do?

Iceman: Sigh.  He is considered the "big man" coach, though thankfully they recently brought Nate James, who has some big man cred, in as an assistant.  I would say Wojo's strength primarily lies in his recruiting and his floor slapping workshops.  Kidding.  But to be honest, he's a nice guy, I met him at graduation last year and he was a normal dude.  If anything, my hope is that he focuses his energy on helping guys like Scheyer find crafty ways to score and move the ball, just like Wojo used to.

Teach: How good is that 2001 Duke team compared to the other champs of the past decade?  Looking at their roster made me reevaluate where they should stand: Carlos Boozer, Chris Duhon, Jason Williams, Dahntay Jones, Shane Battier, and Mike Dunleavy, Jr. (not to mention Nate James).

Iceman: Personally, for me (and I'm quite biased obviously), I think they are better than just about anyone else who has won a Nat'l Championship in the last decade.  Obviously there is NBA talent on every team that gets to the Championship, but that team really did have incredible players at every position.  Jason Williams in particular, was a fantastic player, and in my estimation would have continued to have been the best NBAer of this group had he not been injured beyond repair.  Yes, I'm including Carlos Boozer and Shane Battier in that conclusion.  

I have to temper my Duke fandom a little and say that last year's Tar Heels were a group I would consider similarly stacked with NBA talent, although their success in the NBA is yet to be foreseen.  I know people tout the 2002 Maryland team as a great one, but not compared the 2001 Duke and 2009 Heels.  Oh and didn't Florida win some Championships?  I guess they did, but I don't trust anything Billy Donovan touches.

Teach: What makes this Duke season a success?

Iceman: All of the beat writers and ESPN puff piece writers will say it's the 20+ wins, or they possible ACC Championship, or the continued string of NCAA appearances.  But to me, this team is a success primarily because I think they are over-achieving.  Coming into this season, this was a team with 3 scholarship guards, an all conference PF-ish player transitioning into his role as a wing player, and a slew of unpolished or offensively deficient big men.  Given that make up and some of the "athletic limitations", I'd say that this team is near and dear to my heart for all they have accomplished.  And once again, it goes to show that Coach K is not sliding into his "demise."

This season is also a success because the guys on this team are paving the way for what looks to be a much more balanced and dangerous team next year.  And I have to say I respect the job Scheyer, Zoubek, and Thomas have done on a team that looked a little unsure coming into the season.

Photo Sources: 1, 2, 3 , 4, 5